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Armour use - wearing a helm?
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jack logan Offline
#1 Posted : 17 May 2011 20:40:26

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Having some memory issues, as in i've forgotten something or imagined it :(

I seem to remember reading YEARS ago in LT rules that you could wear a helmet and get armour bonus, without requiring necessary armour use skill.

Now, 2 questions;

1 - out of curiosity, did i imagine this, or did it in fact ever exist?

2 - does it currently exist in the rules


Ta
d511kx Offline
#2 Posted : 17 May 2011 21:28:21

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I may be wrong, but I believe that the answers are as follows:

(1) Way back when (in the days of Rules 1, if I recall correctly), I think that some people running sanctioned events had such a rule on an "event-only" basis. I don't think that it was ever in the formal LT rules. Nowadays, there's far less scope for any such local variations.

(2) No, I don't believe so.
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planegate Offline
#3 Posted : 17 May 2011 21:52:06

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To get any armour bonus you must have the skill or it counts as an AV of Zero. I can't rememeber if you ever could do that but in 94 (?) your head was imm to damage.

"Armour Skills
With these skills, your character can wear amour and gain protection from wearing it. Armour worn
as costume, without the appropriate skill, offers no protection to your character but still restricts
casting spells as normal."

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Kashandara on 17/05/2011
DrakeMorghun Offline
#4 Posted : 17 May 2011 22:03:06

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Under Rules 2, you could wear a helmet without restricting magic use but it never granted the AV (nominally an OOC safety option I believe). That isn't the case under Rules 3.
Oisin Offline
#5 Posted : 18 May 2011 11:20:52

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So, if you wear a metal helm, but do not have Heavy armour use, it counts as AV 0. Whether you have Heavy Armour Use or not, it counts as Heavy Armour for the purposes of spellcasting, which means you cannot cast Ranged or Mass spells while wearing it unless you have the Transcend Armour or Champion OS.
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LeeB Offline
#6 Posted : 18 May 2011 16:19:50

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Shame really, the helm rule in rules 2 was clearly to allow people to wear head protection for OOC safety reasons of not wanting to be injured from head injuries. Rules 3 would be safer if the discouragement of ALL head hits was ever enforced...
Solarian Offline
#7 Posted : 18 May 2011 16:57:14

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When they made heads immune to damage (do discourage head hits), you ended up with people parrying with their heads.
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Kashandara on 18/05/2011, davidrossshaw on 18/05/2011, Marcai on 18/05/2011, d511kx on 18/05/2011, Oisin on 19/05/2011
jack logan Offline
#8 Posted : 18 May 2011 18:35:16

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Thanks guys, appreciate feedback.

Glad i didnt totally imagine it and shame its not still an option as it once was.

Rgds
LeeB Offline
#9 Posted : 18 May 2011 23:36:36

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The head parry.. oh the numpty factor in all its glory.
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crispin on 24/07/2011
Honestmistake Offline
#10 Posted : 19 May 2011 15:18:26

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I seem to remember the rule was that all characters could wear rigid helmets AND that they did count as heavy armour for AV if you had an armour CS but did not stop magic use... I have no idea if it counted as armour for those without a CS though. This would not have only applied to sanctioned events as i have never been to one.
While I am not sure of exact dates I do remember it being it was around the time incantation 'came back' and after the head hits don't count rule, sadly even this still encouraged people to head parry which could well be why it was abandoned pretty quickly.
DM Offline
#11 Posted : 19 May 2011 15:40:49

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That would be massively back in the time of Rules 2 !
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Honestmistake Offline
#12 Posted : 20 May 2011 14:00:09

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yeah but some of us adapt to change much slower than others :)
planegate Offline
#13 Posted : 20 May 2011 14:03:43

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some of us are just slow :)
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Denzil Offline
#14 Posted : 20 May 2011 16:04:44

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I've always found it odd that people wear helmets for safety in combat. I tend to find I get a lot more head hits when wearing a helm than when I'm not.
Just some bloke who hangs around the Armourers guild
jack logan Offline
#15 Posted : 22 May 2011 13:39:45

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DM wrote:
That would be massively back in the time of Rules 2 !


And thats exactly what I was thinking of :)

I started playing in Rules 2, somethings stick in the mind ;)

Rgds
StuartLaws Offline
#16 Posted : 23 May 2011 17:04:33

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I'd love for something that worked to discourage head hits, especially with the number I took/parried on the last day at the spring moot, despite not using a shield and being in a position where the numpty monster(s) could easily have attempted to strike me anywhere else but the head, almost every single attempted and landed blow was on my head...

If it hadn't have been for magical armour, I might have got really annoyed as well as narked off with finding myself moving away from said numpty monster(s).
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Hammerhydra Offline
#17 Posted : 23 May 2011 19:03:29

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Absolutely - there's been a distinctive trend in recent years for large shield users holding their shield low and repeatedly striking at the top of the head. A lot of event guides do now specifically state that players should refrain from head strikes, but the problem does remain.
severus Offline
#18 Posted : 23 May 2011 19:30:05

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I don't see a problem with this as long as the blows are pulled safely and correctly. If you feel the blows aren't safe then pull the player up on it, or get a marshall or ref.
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Malthus on 24/05/2011
Hammerhydra Offline
#19 Posted : 23 May 2011 21:42:49

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From the Combat Safety Rules:

"In the interests of safety, all players should avoid targeting an opponent’s head, if possible, but if necessary, the head is a viable location. Common sense must also dictate that certain other delicate areas of the male and female anatomy should be avoided. Extra care should be taken in large combats with blows to the head, especially with polearms or other large weapons, as this can cause concussion, eye damage or other serious injuries."

As anyone with medical knowledge will tell you, there is no such thing as a "safe" blow to the head. There are only "less risky" blows. And yes, I do report unsafe fighting to the nearest ref/marshall. However, I feel this particular issue is becoming widespread - hence my voicing my concerns here.
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LeeB on 24/05/2011
StuartLaws Offline
#20 Posted : 24 May 2011 15:25:50

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Normally I would agree, if the blow is pulled and otherwise safe what's the problem?

However, having got caught in the eye on several occassions by 'safe pulled blows' to the head, they now pretty much just annoy me, especially as the rulebook suggests you don't go for head hits unless you have too.
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